Rhye's and Fall of Civilization - Chinese strategy
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The Chinese (UHV)
by Abegweit
Overview
The Chinese start out in a truly gorgeous land. There is food everywhere. Wheat, rice, fish, and game are found in almost shockingly abundant quantities. The capital is blessed with three food bonuses, many hills and several other resources. There are calendar luxuries everywhere. To the far north, we find gold and gems. If that wasn’t enough, we have horses to defend ourselves from the barbs (and we will need them, because they will come from the north and the west in great hordes) and will have iron when we learn the tech. Marble is also within reach – and copper too, to build those Big Temples.
In the midst of such abundance, how could you possibly lose? It would be embarrassing.
Research
So let’s start with what is necessary to develop this land to its full potential. The secret is to adopt the proper research order which is... Bronze Working. That’s it. Nothing else. The rest is up to you.
The principal mistake you can make with the Chinese is to fail to research this essential tech. It is not on the path to Math and Calendar but it is the crucial step towards victory. With the chop and the whip, your growth will be rapid and smooth. Your civ will quickly become far bigger and powerful than any other on earth. Without it, you will always be teetering on the line between expanding too fast and expanding too slow. You will forever be attempting to keep the size of your cities down, in the process wasting all that yummy food.
Once you have made this fundamental initial move, you can easily win your UHV. Alternately, you may decide to play a peaceful game and expand to fill your East Asian home from the North Pole to the Equator. Or you can go warmonger. Wipe out the puny Japanese when they arrive – and the Mongolians too. Start west towards the Indians and the Europeans. You can do whatever you want. You own the world.
Of course, it’s not quite as simple as that. BW merely sets the stage. The key to the Chinese is to understand that your economy is more important than a mad rush to Calendar. Take care of your economy and you will get to the goal faster than if you start out for it immediately. I like to continue by researching The Wheel, Fishing, Animal Husbandry, Writing, Math, Pottery, Hunting, Sailing, Calendar, and Currency in that order. Every one of these techs is either essential for the goal of founding the two religions or for building up the economy rapidly and efficiently.
Whipping a few libraries, granaries and markets in food-rich cities will do wonders for your economy so make sure you get the techs for them. Math should get you Iron Working from the Romans. Calendar will get a few more techs. Slipping in Alphabet before Currency in order to trade with the other civs is possible but it is likely to be a mistake. If you want to grow, you will need the extra trade routes and access to markets. Alpha can come next if you like. There is a reason why Currency is the only tech recommended in the startup hints. Like Bronze and Pottery, it is essential for the smooth growth of your civ.
Initial Moves
The warrior explores Korea and then heads off to Europe to meet the Romans and Greeks. It is not essential to do so, but it is nice to trade for a few of their techs before you leave them in the dust. It is not important to ensure his survival either. If he dies, you can always send a chariot after him. Alternately, just stay home and live in magnificent isolation. The Middle Kingdom can do quite well without foreigners, thank you very much!
Back home we need to stake out as much territory as we can as quickly as possible. We need cities ASAP and we should build as many as our economy can stand. Initial build order: worker, worker, settler. Chop, chop, chop! Then let both cities grow a little (start a barracks or train a couple of warriors; it doesn’t matter much) and build two more settlers, one out of each one. At that point, it’s time to build up infra for your four cities. When they all have – or are close to having – the essential buildings (at minimum, a granary and a library), you can consider the possibility of expanding a bit more. But be very careful until you have Currency for the trade routes and the Markets.
The Power of the Bronze
Here is a picture of my empire just as I started researching on Calendar on turn 94.
The tech is due in a very respectable 9 turns. This is almost entirely due to the fact that I had four libraries running six scientists. Without the scientists, it would have taken about 18 turns. Without the libraries? Perhaps 23. In those four cities, there are also three granaries and a barracks. Every building was chopped or whipped, usually both. What would I have had without Bronze? One library. Maybe two? Perhaps a barracks? Certainly no granaries.
Luoyang had just been founded. At this point it was a drain on the economy but that would soon change. In fact, in the next eleven turns, its granary was chopped and its library chop-whipped. All of a sudden, it had become a productive city. You can also see that Tiajin was building a workboat. This is not because it needed one (all the fish already had dinghies) but rather to provide a jump start to my sixth city, which would be built out of Beijing as soon it finished the chariot and a worker. This would be the fourth chariot built. All were vets, as were two warriors.
I could actually have finished the research in eight turns because I soon added additional scientists in Shanghai and Taijin. Instead I chose to whip out workers in Dairen and Taijin, as well as a granary in Shanghai. The overflow from the workers finished the workboat and almost completed the barracks. Another worker was produced the hard way from Beijing. With all these Calendar resources about to come on line, the additional peons were badly needed. All in all, this was a pretty good trade against one turn of research. On the same turn that I discovered Calendar, Beijing’s settler was whipped and ran off to meet the waiting workboat.
BTW, Tiajin provides an instructive case of how to handle the whip and scientists. It is about to reach to its happy limit and will grow far past it long before the work boat is finished. The solution is not to worry and to let it grow. When it gets there, another scientist will be hired. At the same time, we switch to training a worker. Usually it is better to build it the normal way so that the citizens have time to calm down. In this case, we need it badly so we will whip it. In this example, the work boat was built with the overflow and the city started to grow again building something else (a lighthouse as it happened). Each time that the city grows, the new citizens are hired as scientists.
This, in short, is how to handle the whip in food-rich cities. Build something until the city reaches its happy limit, then (probably) switch to a worker or settler. Depending on how unhappy the city is, you may either whip that or the next build. Rinse and repeat. On growth, hire specialists. In this example, all we are allowed are scientists but merchants and engineers are good too. Except in special cases avoid priests. The one downside with this technique is that it takes a lot of micro-management. Each turn you must go through all the cities, checking to see whether to add a specialist or if the happy cap has changed. However, the benefits are clearly enormous – and we haven’t even talked about all the GPs this technique generates. In going for the UHV, it is best to use them for Super Scientists. You want the benefit immediately.
Barbarians
The only other pitfall is failing to keep up your military. The barbians will come in swarms of three and more at a time. There will be horse archers out of the north and west (mostly the north) and swordsmen from Tibet. In Warlords, The Great Wall would be an ideal addition to your empire. You won’t want to expand north or west anyway. As soon as you get Construction, go for it. Be warned that theres a risk with the Great Wall: the barbarians can enter your territory in some situations like civil wars, revolting cities etc. Its better to kill them if they camp before you!
Playing in Vanilla, you can’t rely on such crutches. Without it, you absolutely must connect the iron at Beijing ASAP. This should happen around the time you research Calendar. If you can’t get Iron from the Romans, you will have to research it yourself. Julie can be something of a dick. If you can’t get it the first time you ask, don’t settle for less. You can usually get it later. I assume that this is because more civs (that he knows?) learn the tech so the price goes down. Once you hook up the Iron, Spears are the priority. It is possible to whip out an Axe if you see danger approaching but there is no time to react if mounted units appear.
Place three axemen on the hill entering into Tibet. Then spread spears along your northern border and on the iron at Beijing. The axes should be nearly invulnerable. You are liable to lose one spear on each attack from the north. Salute the dead hero, get a new recruit to replace him and move forward.
Academies and Pagodas
After you have Currency, your civilization needs to grow again. The requirements for a Big Temple are Music and four little temples. I assume the fourth one is due to the size of the map but it may be simply RFC. Anyway the bottom line is that you need four, so you must have at least eight cities.
You will need Alphabet, Literature and Music in order to get the right to build Big Temples, and you need Priesthood for little ones. With reasonable luck, Confucianism will have spread though most of your cities but Taoism is definitely going to require missionaries. While it is possible to build them out of Monasteries, Organized Religion makes things much more flexible and the building bonus is not to be distained either. So you will need all five early religious techs as well. You should be able to trade for most of the religious techs, so research Alphabet first and then move on to Literature and Music once you the religious techs.
Oh, and don’t forget to bring the copper on line to in order to double the building speed of your BTs. For the same reason, a detour to Metal Casting is well worth it. In fact, that would be my next project after Alpha. Alternately, you may be to get it from Julie or Alex in exchange for Currency and something else.
Mongols
The Mongols start with seven keshiks, two horse archers and three crossbowmen. They will be found on the shores of the lake(Lake Baikal) to the northwest of Beijing. Pikes are fine against the keshiks but the crossbows will eat them alive. The solution is war elephants, which have 8 strength and a 50% bonus against mounted troops and thus are stronger than any Mongol units. About fifteen WEs should do it. There is Ivory at Angkor. Hook it up and eat ’em up before they become a threat.
I don’t know why you say hello…
I say goodbye.
Note The Great Wall of Human Bodies. Roads across it are essential.
The Chinese (UHV for BTS 600AD start)
by wr4th
600AD A lot of work to be done, 16 temples and 4 cathedrals within 40 turns! Sounds impossible, but it can be done...
Found Bejing on the spot, start building worker, 2 workers start pasture the pigs, one settler S to found Guiyang NW of copper (important for academys and pagodas) together with archer, cuz Khmer tend to declare war at some point, the other settler goes E to found Shenyang between wheat and pigs, horsearcher moves SE to Hangzhou (no defender), one Cho-Ko-Nu S to Guangzhou (spearman defender), the other to tibet (2 warrior in Lhasa one swordsman NW of Lhasa), 2 swordsmen E to Seoul. Change Civic to Bureaucracy / Slavery (1 turn anarchy) and start teching for monotheism. tech path: monotheism - engineering (for pikemen and castles) - guilds - banking (for your suffering economy) - philosophy - nationalism (for drafting your third victory condition)
On the next turn Qufu and Xi'an flip to you they have both temples each already built. The archer can stay in Qufu, one spearman to Bejing the other to Shenyang to defend from barbarians. Switch to confucianism.
All towns start with building a worker. Except Guangzhou and Hangzhou they will build a workboat and whip it when reaching pop 2.
When the pigs are done the first worker moves to build a mine on the iron next to bejing, the other chops the silk. For now only chop, never build the ressources it costs to much time and your towns won't be working more than 2 tiles anyway. And only build roads where its usefull for your missionaries, all ressources can be connected quick after 1000AD with 10 or more workers running around.
Guangzhou is easy for your Cho-Ko-Nu, and so is Lhasa. The one from Guangzhou should go up to Xi'an if a swordman spawns between there and Lhasa (happened once to me, very annoying). Seoul has a Longbowman vs 2 of your swordsmen. Its about 50% chance to succeed. If you don't...just reload :)
In 660AD China should look like this:
On the next turn Lhasa will fall, which in fact is pretty useless. Its town number 9 and i just use it for building workers. 2 until 1000AD, after that do what you like. Switch to Hereditary Rule and Organized Religion religion on your next turn.
Babarians from the north are a pain, but with 2 spearmen each in bejing and shenyang and maybe walls you are save. They dont pillage so let them come but be carefull with your workers.
Spearmen can be whipped in one turn, so i wait with that until barbarians appear. In my winning game the first wave actually game before i connected the iron, but i put the spearman on the hill while my worker was working and they just attacked and died.
The worker built in bejing irrigates the wheat N of Qufu, the worker captured in Korea builds a road to shenyang and pastures the pig. The worker which chopped the silk goes to Xi'an and the other stays at bejing. Qufu worker goes to Hangzhou and Guiyang worker starts mining the copper.
Bejing, Qufu and Xi'an will be building missionaries until all towns except Lhasa have confucianism and taoism. Remember there can be no more than 3 of one type so build them evenly and also make sure every city gets one religion first so they can start with the temples right away. When Qufu is done with missionaries build more workers here.
The procedure for building is always chop, then whip. Even whip if its done in one turn to produce more hammers for your next task. Also make sure that you always finish 4 temples of one type so you can start with one cathedral. They will be built in Bejing, Xi'an, Hancheng and Guiyang. Xi'an should not use more than 2 chops for missionaries, that leaves three for the cathedral, it will stay at 2 pop so DONT whip there!! You also need 2 mines to work at Xi'an or you won't finish in time. This should be the first cathedral to start.
After that you start in Bejing cuz the other towns will still be busy with the temples. Start moving workers south as soon as possible. Guangzhou and Hangzhou are always last when finishing temples.
Always connect one food ressource for each town so it can regrow fast. Hancheng can produce 2 woarkboats in between temples and Guiyang can be your last cathedral, with 5 chops left and all your workers free it can finish in 3 or 4 turns.
Right now it should be 1000AD, take a deep breath and go on for your next challange. 200 Years until the mongols arrive. All your workers are free to connect every ressource thats lying around, northern towns should build castles, qufu builds grocer and bank when available. Forge in all towns. And after that units, units, units... Focus on cheap pikemen, and maybe some cho-ko-nu. Dont forget to whip everytime you can. Your military presence will solve the unhappyness.
If Khmer or Japan declare war on you, just dont care. They wont send anything that could harm you. Just be sure to spread your troops evenly.
When in 1200AD the mongols appear they will be no match. They didnt even dare to declare in my game. bejing and shenyang are right outside their boarders so no flipping occurs.
Wait til 1400 to get your golden age. Switch to nationhood when available and draft what is neccessary to hit the 120 troops mark. So after hitting goal number one its fairly easy.
The Chinese (Emperor)
by pku_phone
Overview
In Emperor difficulty, the UHV of Chinese is very hard to be accomplished, but not impossible. The problem is the first UHV condition: build 2 Confucian Academies and 2 Taoist Pagodas by 1000 AD. To achieve this condition, we must discover Mathematics and Calendar first to found Confucianism and Taoism, we must get the Music in time , we must get at least 8 cities , spread Confucianism and Taoism and build enough temple in them and finnally construct the Academies and Pagodas by 1000 AD.
Founding Religions
It is very hard for Chinese to found Confucianism and Taoism because of the extremely expensive technologies. If we research Animal Husbandry- Writing-Mathematics directly, we can never found Confucianism. Egypt can discover Mathematics in 75 turns, sometimes 60 turns. The method to get Confucianism is published first in http://www.civclub.net/bbs/viewthread.php?tid=24929&extra=page%3D2 and developed by several other persons. We must research Mysticism first and build Stonehenge. Then we adopt Caste System and generate a Great Scientist to discover Mathematics . There is a chance to get a Great Prophet because of Stonehenge, but we must push our luck.
It is much more difficult to found Taoism. There is no great people to discover Calendar and Egypt can discover the technology in 100 turns (even 89 turns). We need more cities to feed scientists to boost our research. 3 cities can give the max output of researching by 100 turns. One city should settle before Confucianism founding. Usually, the Greeks can discover Alphabet in 75 turns and we can ues Agriculture, Animal Husbandry and Mathematics to exchange Sailing if the Greeks are willing to trade it(it is quite a small chance). We also need to get enough gold from the goody huts. Otherwise we can only hope that Egypt focus their researching on Theology.
Technology researching
Discovering Music in time is as hard as founding the religions. There are two ways to achieve it, both ways require you to conquer Japan and construct the Great Lighthouse. If the Japanese can build Colossus before we conquer them, then we can suffer any kind of the second great people and have no time limit for the generation of him. Else, we must generate a Great Artist to discover Aesthetics. Since Polytheism and Monotheism have higher priority than Aesthetics, we should get Polytheism beforehand and delay to get Masonry, which will postpone the construction of Great Lighthouse.
The Chinese BTS 1.186 UHV
By The_K
I'm not in the mood to write a long guide. However, I just finished the Chinese UHV on monarch and you fail pitifully if you follow the above strategy. The changes in 1.181 are probably responsible for that.
WHAT TO DO:
Build Beijing on the spot. Start producing a worker and go for Bronze working. After you get the worker, the city should get to size 3 and build a settler. To get to size 3 build a warrior or start a barracks or something. As soon as you get Bronze Working switch to slavery. The chop and whip technique still applies. So during the course of the game remember to use it as already stated in the above guide. Your first settler should build a city 1 north and 5 east of Beijing (between river and grain).
THE WARRIOR:
Send the warrior south-east to collect the goody hut and then back to Beijing and east. The objective is to get to the balkans and asia-minor to get the goody huts there. After that you can also get the one in Denmark and Spain. After the collection you should fortify the warrior on the south end of the Apennine Peninsula so as to have permanent contact with Greece, Rome and Carthage. This will serve you well to trade tech.
HOW TO CONTINUE:
After Bronze Working, you should get fishing, wheel, pottery, writing mathematics. This shouldn't be to hard and you will get Confucianism. You should trade to get hunting, animal husbandry, mysticism and as many other techs you can get. Try to get Iron working that is very important. You should also build a third city, 4 south-east and 1 south of Beijing. Three cities are quite enough for now. Use workers to work the terrain around them. Each city should quickly have a library, barracks and granary.
STRANGE STEP
Now go for Masonary and Construction. Yep, you heard me. It is important to get construction first so you can build the Great Wall. The colosseum is a nice touch and you can easily get it as well, but you MUST build the Great Wall. It will keep you safe from barbarians. You should also build a galley or two in your port city and a few war units (catapults, axemen, swordsmen, a chariot or two...). You don't need a lot, just get them all over to the Japanese island and then declare war. You can quickly take his cities (there's usually 3 cities).
That's it. After construction research the calendar. There's a bit of luck here and sometimes someone will get it before you do. However, you can get it and have Taoism (start research for Music). Now you have the great wall to protect you, no Japan to bother you and 6 cities. Build 2 more and reach the first UHV objective.
For the second objective simply follow the above strategy with War elephants to wipe out mongolia and then build units.
